Altrenate Carrier for the 80's RN

[adenandy]

Well, good luck with that, it sounds really interesting!

I can't wait to see what you come up with

[acelanceloet]

type 42,43,44 and 23 are most likely the ones to look at. and maybe the earlier escort cruiser studies.....

[shippy2013]

My dilemma at the moment is missile systems, Pre Faulklands RN was based around, Exocet, Ikara, Sea Dart and Sea Cat and Sea Wolf with Harpoon just coming in. If the RN was restructuring and re equipping what is the likely armament, I'd suspect the venerable 4.5in but an advanced Sea Dart, maybe an American system bought in, British arms manufacturers my have had some thing to say about this. Sea Wolf would probably still provided short range protection, along with Phalanx or Goalkeeper. But as for anti ship and medium to long range anti air... Would the Brits have stuck with Exocet, moved to Harpoon or a new indigenous system. Maybe a dual purpose missile Sea Dart had a limited anti ship capability too, although the warhead remained in-active and it was the kenetic and whatever propellant was left to burn that did the damage...
Propulsion would almost certainly be gas turbines.

[acelanceloet]

I agree on all points. I'd think sea dart would be retained, or tartar might be fitted (more likely just sea dart or sea dart 2.0)
sea wolf would be the VLS version, and I might even see an VLS sea dart proposal if an ship equipped with it would be designed.
and the ASM would, I think, depend on what the aircraft fitted. good idea to keep the cost low if both have OR exocet OR harpoon. an new system would seem unlikely to me. (and please pick goalkeeper, there are never enough goalkeepers )

[shippy2013]

Let's see....
Following the Faulklands the RN frontline fleet consisted of 3 carriers, one centaur and two Invincibles with a 3rd under construction. 8 type 42,s with 3 under construction. 4 county class destroyers (1 out of action following an Exocet hit). 6 type 21's, 8 Type 22's with 4 under construction ( 2 of which were named Sheffeild and Coventry as replacements). A number of type 12l Leander's and the Type 82 Bristol. 4 SSN's of the Churchill or Valliant class, 6 Swiftsure class SSN's and 4 Resolution class SSBN.

So in my line of events. Following the Falklands the Royal Navy is to increase in size and repair the damage done by the politicians in the 70's.
The carrier fleet was totally rethought. 4 CVN Class carriers were built between 1987 and 1991.
The centaur class carrier Hermes is sold.
The invincibles are sold off to Australia, Canada and New Zealand.
The 11 type 42's would be retained as these were relatively new 1978-85
The single type 82 would probably soldier on into the early 90's until a newer fleet cruiser (fulfilling a similar role to the American Aegis cruiser in the carrier defence role) could replace a non standard vessel (My first design)
The County Class destroyers would be disposed of soon after the war, they would be replaced by 4 to 6 new ships probably an interim design before the fleet cruiser, a modified type 42.
The Type 12l Leander's would be quickly phased out, built in the 60's they were beginning to wear out, they would be replaced by a new general purpose Frigate (My second Design)
The type 21's, would be rapidly disposed of and replaced to by a new general purpose Frigate.
The type 22's being relatively new 1978-89 would be retained with possibly the batch 3 order increased by 2 hulls to help fill a gap created by the early disposal of the leander and amazon class.
The Churchill and Valliant class SSN's would give way to 7 Trafalgar class SSN's in 1983-91
The 6 Swifsure class would be retained again these were relatively new 1976-80.
The Resolution class would have been in the process of being replaced by the Vanguards between 1992-99. Dependent on hull condition and if replacing the old reactors is possible maybe converted to SSCM,s. (Rotary Tomahawk launchers installed in place of the Polaris missiles).
Fleet Cruisers (My first design) 8 hulls to replace the type 82, County class and Tiger Class, provide air defence for carrier battle groups and flagship duties, to be built 1987-92
General Purpose Frigate (My second design) upto 25 hulls to replace the Leander, Amazon an batch 1 type 22's, to be built 1985-95.

[sparky42]

Let's see....
Following the Faulklands the RN frontline fleet consisted of 3 carriers, one centaur and two Invincibles with a 3rd under construction. 8 type 42,s with 3 under construction. 4 county class destroyers (1 out of action following an Exocet hit). 6 type 21's, 8 Type 22's with 4 under construction ( 2 of which were named Sheffeild and Coventry as replacements). A number of type 12l Leander's and the Type 82 Bristol. 4 SSN's of the Churchill or Valliant class, 6 Swiftsure class SSN's and 4 Resolution class SSBN.

So in my line of events. Following the Falklands the Royal Navy is to increase in size and repair the damage done by the politicians in the 70's.
The carrier fleet was totally rethought. 4 CVN Class carriers were built between 1987 and 1991.
The centaur class carrier Hermes is sold.
The invincibles are sold off to Australia, Canada and New Zealand.
The 11 type 42's would be retained as these were relatively new 1978-85
The single type 82 would probably soldier on into the early 90's until a newer fleet cruiser (fulfilling a similar role to the American Aegis cruiser in the carrier defence role) could replace a non standard vessel (My first design)
The County Class destroyers would be disposed of soon after the war, they would be replaced by 4 to 6 new ships probably an interim design before the fleet cruiser, a modified type 42.
The Type 12l Leander's would be quickly phased out, built in the 60's they were beginning to wear out, they would be replaced by a new general purpose Frigate (My second Design)
The type 21's, would be rapidly disposed of and replaced to by a new general purpose Frigate.
The type 22's being relatively new 1978-89 would be retained with possibly the batch 3 order increased by 2 hulls to help fill a gap created by the early disposal of the leander and amazon class.
The Churchill and Valliant class SSN's would give way to 7 Trafalgar class SSN's in 1983-91
The 6 Swifsure class would be retained again these were relatively new 1976-80.
The Resolution class would have been in the process of being replaced by the Vanguards between 1992-99. Dependent on hull condition and if replacing the old reactors is possible maybe converted to SSCM,s. (Rotary Tomahawk launchers installed in place of the Polaris missiles).
Fleet Cruisers (My first design) 8 hulls to replace the type 82, County class and Tiger Class, provide air defence for carrier battle groups and flagship duties, to be built 1987-92
General Purpose Frigate (My second design) upto 25 hulls to replace the Leander, Amazon an batch 1 type 22's, to be built 1985-95.

4 CVN's designed and built within 10 years? That seems more than a little optimistic to me.

[Thiel]

Given the complexity of a nuclear powered aircraft carrier I'd say four years between keel laying and launch and at least another year pier side fitting out would be more realistic.
And given the sheer amount of other vessels you're building I doubt you'll have the resources to build more than one at a time.
Assuming you spend the time between the Falklands War and 1987 on creating the necessary infrastucture and designing the ships, by no means a small job by any means. In fact five years might not be enough to design the ships, even with US assistance. It took the USN eight years to design the Nimitz class and they had the not inconsiderable advantages of having a nuclear carrier in service and being able to base the ship to some degree on the Kitty Hawk class.

[acelanceloet]

while it is always the worst example, the french did 10 years from keel laying to commissioning for their CVN.......

[shippy2013]

If Design work began in 1983 don't think it Would be to optimistic, plus 4th probably wouldn't be fully operational till at least 1998 that's 15 years, Two could be built at Rosyth and two in Belfast.

Has any body got any ideas of a hull form for a cruiser 1980's/90's kind of midway between the type 82/42 and an enlarged type 22. Speed and stability are a must..

1 st attempt using the type 42/82 and 22 combined

[acelanceloet]

please use this:
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63276563/Mk%20 ... %20155.png
on the hull. that knuckle in the stern will be an major strength problem, keep the hull flush decked. other then that it looks allright, if it works depends on the systems fitted. will it be an true cruiser or more of an DLG/ type 82 sized ship?