Grays Harbor Designs

[Zephyr]

I could use some opinions please. I started on another class of destroyers the other day, commissioned between 1973-84. First, I tried going a bit smaller, along the lines of the Canadian Tribals or the UK Sheffields, and that wasn't working for me as I kept getting stuck for ideas. Next I tried going a bit larger, somehing along the lines of a Spruance, and that wasn't working either. I don't know if its just me and my standard fear of radar or what.

So, I could use some opinions pro and con to either a largeish hull (approx. 515-540') or smaller hull (approx. 430-460'). Primary mission would be fleet air defense with ASW secondary.

Now, I'm not looking for folks to draw this for me. Where's the fun in that? Just looking for some ideas and opinions as to which direction to go, or if there is a third or 4th option, I'd like to hear that too. Maybe getting some ideas tossed about will break my block on this.

[Thiel]

I'm not a big fan of angular funnels. I really prefer gently rounded ends. It just looks better to me. Is there a reason to go angular instead of rounded besides aesthetics?

They are significantly cheaper to build and they have better stealth performance

Why no sponson? Just curious.

The way you've drawn them they'll act as a gigantic radar reflector. Besides, like on the Kasten class there's several other places where you can put them and get about the same coverage.

I don't really see the problem with having a Mk.29 on there. This ship, after all, was designed with a single purpose, to be a surface strike ship. AA is purely point defense. The ship as designed was literally built around the Viper NSM, to be nothing more than an efficient delivery system for SSM's. I chose the Mk.29 because it has a relatively small footprint, no deck penetration and an effective missile in the SeaSpike Mk IV (RIM-162 ESSM). Putting the ESSM in the regular VLS tubes would take space away from packing in more Vipers. Being quadpacked, admitedly not much, but some nonetheless. I also couldn't find a reasonable slot for a Mk.48 VLS except maybe the small Mod 0 or Mod 1. As it stands though, I remembered I also use the SeaDagger (RIM-116 RAM) so I replaced the Mk.29 with a Mk.49 with the bonus I guess you could say of having 21 missiles instead of only 8.

If any of that makes sense ...

It doesn't. The part about the Mk. 29 launcher and ESSM does, but building a ship this big as a purely ASuW platform doesn't.
I've mentioned this before, but to recap, in order to be a good ASuW platform you have to be able to defend against a reply in kind. For a FAC that means running and hiding, for you that means being able to shoot the missiles down. The only exceptions I'm aware of are conversions of older designs that didn't have the ability to mount both. You, however, are building a brand new ship from the bottom up, which means you have all the options in the world to incorporate a proper defensive system.
The fact that you have carriers and SSGNs also means that the design is redundant. You've already got all the ASuW weaponry you're ever going to need right there. Honestly I think you'd be better off building more Point Blanches since they can defend themselves and enhance the task force's defences. And nothing is stopping you from loading ASMs in the VLS tubes.

[Zephyr]

Oh, There will be more PB's. Perhaps the beginnings of a "Blancheswarm". Once I get a design nailed down, that is.

Sponson as radar reflector. See, when put like that, I understand the reasoning.

I may cut back the St Edwards from 12 to maybe 6 or 8 and increase the Kasten series and PB's some. I was initially planning on only having 12 of the PB's. Maybe increase that to 18-24.

[TimothyC]

I could use some opinions please. I started on another class of destroyers the other day, commissioned between 1973-84. First, I tried going a bit smaller, along the lines of the Canadian Tribals or the UK Sheffields, and that wasn't working for me as I kept getting stuck for ideas. Next I tried going a bit larger, somehing along the lines of a Spruance, and that wasn't working either. I don't know if its just me and my standard fear of radar or what.

So, I could use some opinions pro and con to either a largeish hull (approx. 515-540') or smaller hull (approx. 430-460'). Primary mission would be fleet air defense with ASW secondary.

Now, I'm not looking for folks to draw this for me. Where's the fun in that? Just looking for some ideas and opinions as to which direction to go, or if there is a third or 4th option, I'd like to hear that too. Maybe getting some ideas tossed about will break my block on this.

Well DG/Perry is in the middle - the downside is that it would probably cost about ¾+ of a Kidd, while only being ½ to ⅔ of the ship.

For the larger cruisers, I think I said this to you in a PM, but something like CGBL might be a good inspiration.

[Zephyr]

Well DG/Perry is in the middle - the downside is that it would probably cost about ¾+ of a Kidd, while only being ½ to ⅔ of the ship.

Nice looking ship, but I'm kinda looking for early 70's. Of course, we could always just backdate all the electronics, put what was available on there in place of what is there now. I may have to look at that some.

For the larger cruisers, I think I said this to you in a PM, but something like CGBL might be a good inspiration.

Umm ... I wasn't doing a cruiser this time, just trying to figure out whether I want a small DDG (Halifax/Manchester) or a large DDG (Spruance) for my early-mid 70's class that the Kastens and PB's eventually replace.

[Trojan]

Halifax entered service in the 90s
do you mean the Tribals as u mentioned before or are you gonna backdate the Halifax

[Zephyr]

Halifax entered service in the 90s
do you mean the Tribals as u mentioned before or are you gonna backdate the Halifax

Meant the tribal. Misstyped. Was looking at a page on the Halifaxes to get some ideas on frigates for later on and when I did the reply I meant "Tribal" and it came out "Halifax".

I'm old, sue me.

and speaking of DDG's, something like this is kinda what I was thinking about. Yes, it is just a quick mash-up and not necessarily what it will look like finished. Just a quick idea of what the concept may look like when I get an idea of the concept.

[Novice]

Zephyr the bow on your latest seem to me to be too short.

[acelanceloet]

and I don't think that hull can take the mk26 GMLS. to be exact: the DG/perry was an design that was to be the smallest design that could take an mk 26 mod 1. for how long your hull should be in front of the GMLS to let it fit in the structure...... there you should look at DG/AEGIS viewtopic.php?f=13&t=456&view=unread#unread .

on what you have now, you might just fit an mk 13 in that position. mk 26 won't fit there, even if it fits on the ship at all!

[Clonecommander6454]

I think Mk 26 Mod 0 should be the max on this hull.